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EP PODCASTSXML

June 13, 2008

Apartheid: For or Against??

Palestine Inside Out coverThe U.S. pays for and protects a system of Apartheid in Israel. The U.S. government routinely lies about this, describing Israel as a "Democracy." Worse, the U.S. encourages Israeli Jews to keep those Palestinians who live in Gaza and the West Bank in a sort of outdoor prison-cum-shooting gallery. Absolutely contrary to what many of the Left have argued, seemingly forever, Jews are the ones calling the shots. It's the most odious, obscene abuse of human beings in the world — precisely because its necessary enabler is a leader among nations but also the greatest hypocrite regarding human rights. To hear further from the Palestinian side I turned to Dr. Saree Makdisi, author of Palestine Inside Out, who seems to be picking up where his late uncle, Edward Said, left off. It was very kind of Saree to talk with me, I learned a lot, and I hope we can do it again. Total runtime an hour and four minutes. Help educate your family, friends, co-workers, neighbors, and friendly strangers.

Listen

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Comments

Well, you asked for more comments.

This interview was a good one — don't worry about the technical deficiencies; the content is more important.

Of course US support of the Israeli right doesn't serve the interests of the people of the US; but Chomsky et al. are correct that it serves the interest of those in power, in many ways, subtle and otherwise.

As well, your support for Obama isn't in the interest of the people of the US, either, but you have found your reasons to do so.

Bugliosi was on Democracy now today — take a listen; I was a little disappointed, content-wise, but you may do better with an in-depth interview.

On a less political note, please consider having someone address personality-type (e.g., Myers-Briggs) theory. I remember you mentioning your interest in this somewhere - I agree that it is illuminating, and I went into it as a severe skeptic.

I know several people who have spent time at St. George's College in Jerusalem, run by the Anglican Church. While they were mostly apolitical before they went, they have all returned vehemently anti Israeli. Why?

One story will suffice. A Palestinian woman was having a difficult pregnancy, and it became clear that she needed to go to a hospital immediately. Her husband knew that the only way to get her there fast enough would be to use a road that was restricted. Sure enough, he was apprehended, delayed, questioned, delayed some more. By the time the Israelis let them go, it was too late. The baby died.

You would think that the Jews of all people on earth would know about oppression, and not want to inflict it on others. But then, as Laurens Van der Post said, no country founded on the basis of so much evil could every prosper.

Believe it or not, there was a time when I read David Horowitz and Robert Spencer. Spencer's big theme is that Mohammed is 'normative' to Muslims, which is interpreted to mean that all Muslims must be holy warriors in their hearts, and those who aren't overtly militant are just pretending and are waiting in ambush. Many conservatives now believe this. That is why it is important to have rational, cultured and soft-spoken Muslim guests like this one, to combat the lie.

Some Muslims are extremists, to be sure, but so are some Christians, despite Jesus preaching peace and love. This may seem like a trite statement, but obviously millions of Republicans think otherwise. Besides, Muslim anger against the West has considerable justification. And let's face it: the Middle East needs an Enlightenment, which intellectuals like this guest may be helping to create. I hope so.

According to Wikipedia, Dr. Makdisi is related to Edward Said. I don't know too much about Edward Said's gripes against 'orientalism'. I'm sure there is much truth to his thesis, but at the same time I think we should forgive Westerners who get fanciful and romantic ideas about the Middle East, or Asia for that matter, as long as there is no prejudice. There's nothing wrong with a little Arabian Nights escapism from time to time!

As for the wind, let me be honest: Grrrrr!

While the wind noise and the trucks were unpleasant, the content far outweighed the technical glitches. I wish I could be as optimistic as Dr. Makdisi. While access to the facts about the Israeli government's treatment of Palestinians would convince some, we have an enormous capacity to ignore or disbelieve facts in this country.

There's an interesting article on American Anti-Intellectualism by Susan Jacoby (could be an interesting guest) that reinforces the pessimistic view.

Ouch! I should have listened to the whole thing. I did not realize that Dr. Makdisi was Christian, and I was astonished to discover that most Arab-Americans are Christians. Well, my point remains that simplistic and dangerous ideas about Muslims are becoming quite prevalent in the right-wing blogosphere. That's a fact. Dr. Makdisi proves that education is the key to people becoming civilized, even if your religious tradition has its dark side, and whose doesn't? Unfortunately, education is not always enough!

One of the ironies connected with the fundamentalist movement is that their strong support of the Jewish settlers is based on their belief that a condition for the Second Coming is the re establishment of Israel's original borders. Yet many of the people that have been displaced, often from houses their families have occupied for centuries, are Christian, and their ancestors have been for longer than any of the fundamentalists' forefathers. "Them" vs. "us", so much of their normal "thinking", is superseded by their supposedly literal belief in the bible. It's so ridiculous it would be funny if the consequences for many weren't so awful.

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